Duke Nukem Forever — Reviews
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100% Reviews
8.5 Years Agoall2surreal
100%PC
Shit game!
90% Reviews
1 Year AgoKillinCat
90%PC
How did anyone take this game seriously
6.5 Years AgoRODILLATOR
90%PlayStation 3
8’6
80% Reviews
8.5 Years AgoRygaar
80%PC
First 2 hours are not really fun (gross sense of humour, graphics rather dated, and action is slow to come).
But after that, it’s pretty action pack, and I had a lot of fun.
OK, the game is not what everybody expected (for fans service) but it’s not such a bad game like everyone wants to believe.
10.5 Years AgoBrizik
80%PC
A lot better than most give it credit for.
Bad dateRickyButler
80%PC
Had the lowest of expectations and ended up having a blast with this game. Just make sure you turn on the 4-weapon loadout (defaults w/ this off) before playing. Did a couple extra achievos on the side.
Bad dateDeathCode
80%PlayStation 3
Game wasn’t all that bad. I thought it was a good game. Not so much driving either. Other then that 52% Tropies andbeat the game on Normal Mode.
70% Reviews
1 Year AgoTheOro44
70%PC
—
+ coole Bossk�mpfe
+ anarchisch-charismatische Hauptfigur
+ gute Steuerung
+ knackiger Schwierigkeitsgrad
+ Umgebungsr�tsel
+ gelungene Action-Adventure-Sequenzen
+ Sex, Drugs & Rock’n’Roll
+ coole Kommentare
+ ordentliche Kampagnen-Spieldauer
+ mitunter �berraschende Mischung bekannter Action-Elemente
+ umfangreiches Bonus-Material
— technisch veraltet
— Tearing, Pop- Ups, Ruckler, matschige Texturen
— Schwierigkeitsgrad ung�nstig ausbalanciert
— Ballereien meist auf Arena- K�mpfe beschr�nkt
— Qualit�t der einzelnen Abschnitte schwankt stark
— marode KI
— lineare Schlauch- Levels
Wertung: 77% (gut)
(Beendet auf Insane + TDWCM)
5 Years Agoninjaalex
70%Xbox 360
Good game letdown by some tedious platforming.
6 Years AgoHWLights92
70%PC
Great first person shooter with a lot of humor but it doesn’t live up to the Duke Nukem name, per say.
8.5 Years AgoTheOro44
70%Xbox 360
—
+ coole Bossk
9 Years AgoAlleyViper620
70%PlayStation 3
Probably one hour of the total time was spent on the atrocious loading screens. Dated graphics with lifeless character models. Core gameplay was actually not that bad though. It definitely didn’t get boring, although they did not need 8 levels in the dam.
10 Years AgoKarin
70%PC
Not as bad a game as many thought. I enjoyed it, wasn’t expecting much, had a good time with Duke, and had no problem saying it was worth it.
10 Years AgoWolf_7
70%Xbox 360
Decent enough, exactly what I would expect from a duke game…dont see why everyone had such a big problem with it…had only a few annoyances wle other more polished games have provided a lot more.
.. The low res textures here are a bit off place for this far into the generation cycle, but given the games development history its understandable and forgivable… Overall a good choice they eventualy decided to complete and release the game…
10.5 Years AgoSulz
70%PC
PC is highly recommended for this game; it matters a lot.
The game doesn’t play quite the same as its predecessor, Duke Nukem 3d; overall, it feels like a much slower-paced game, though it does have its moments. This is a complaint that many leverage against the game frequently, and though it’s not entirely unfounded, I find that the game stands well enough on its own. Gunplay in the game is still fun as ever, but feels infrequent at times and often limited by the fact that you’re only allowed 2 weapons; usually the ammo pool for these weapons are small as well, which further causes problems at times. A patch is available for the PC version that allows you to carry 4 weapons, but I have to judge on the 2 weapon system, since it’s what I used.
Oddly enough, the most enjoyable parts of this game to me were the most unconventional parts of it. There are numerous scenes where Duke is shrunken to action figure size and forced to navigate through, now huge, everyday objects. It reminds you a little bit of Toy Story or maybe the Army Men games, and its a nice, interesting change of pace. The level design here is incredible, as normal levels become totally different suddenly thanks to your new perspective. There are also vehicle sections which, though not necessarily amazing, are a fun diversion. Overall, the game has a nice variety of levels and settings as well, though some are better than others (Duke Burger is great while The Hive level is disturbing and a really jarring shift in tone).
The classic Duke humor is here as well, though it gets much grittier here; the original game felt very tongue-in-cheek, while here it feels more serious and like the game is trying to be as macho as humanly possible. I don’t mind this so much, but I feel the delivery is very inept at times.
It also has a few good jabs at other shooters (notably Doom and Halo), which are pretty good. Overall, its funny but falls flat at times.
Overall, the game is decent and worth a look.
60% Reviews
2 Months AgoCptJackZ
60%PC
Hm.
8 Months Agoeltiovictor
60%PC
Repetitivo hasta hartarse
11.5 Months Agoxxcoolsjxx
60%Xbox 360
Only thing that really makes this a 6 instead of a 5 is probably because it is Duke Nukem. Some nostalgia drives this game, but other than that it kind of sucks that this game took so long to develop and was really a subpar FPS for its time.
1 Year AgoGregorit
60%PC
«I’ve got balls of fail.» (Sadly, mediocre game)
2.5 Years AgoMarloges
60%PlayStation 3
I never really understood the hate for this game. Sure, the expectations might have been pretty high after so many years, but I thought it was a decent shooter with a lot of humour and a good length.
I don’t have that much to complain actually. It’s just not «special».
2.5 Years AgoLP_
60%PC
The most infamous case of a game stuck in development hell. After so many years of waiting, the final product could never live up to the hype. But despite all the disappointment, Duke Nukem Forever is still a somewhat decent game if you can put all your expectation aside.
3 Years AgoPrivate
60%PC
Going into this game with low expectations, I expected a first-person shooter game with, of course, the man himself Duke. What I actually found while playing this game is that it reminded me of Half-Life a lot more than any of the classic 90’s shooter games. While the combat can feel a bit clunky at times (like Half-Life), and sometimes the puzzles can be too tricky to solve without referring to a guide (like Half-Life), I have enjoyed playing this game, with the Duke Nukem humour being one of my favourite aspects.
6 Years Agoskyelogic
60%PC
It’s a basic first-person shooter with stupid punchlines.
The storyline isn’t every good, but funny. The story has its moments. I would call this a great teen game for immature boys with raunchy humor. If you don’t fit in that category then who cares.. pass on this one ;P
6.5 Years AgoJezusoid
60%PC
Not bad enough to hate, not good enough to love. It can provide some entertainment here and there, but the pacing is all over the place and too often the game just drags on.
8 Years AgoGrandeGarcia
60%PlayStation 3
not THAT bad, which the a grand part of reviewers scored it to be.
9 Years Agothanalis
60%PC
Not a bad game, not a good game. Duke’s one liners are humorous, though clich
10.5 Years AgoPrivate
60%PC
+The interactivity of levels and objects. Adding to your «Ego» bar as an incentive to play around with the world is also a nice touch, though prodding you to find interactive objects will also force you to find out just how many objects are not interactive at all.
+A good variety of weapons that are all fairly satisfying to use (except the Freeze Gun, which didn’t seem to work for me at all) and pipebombs come up often enough to be used constantly.
+Though a lot of the one liners miss their mark, the game has a sense of humor and isn’t afraid to push certain boundaries.
+Having shootouts while the size of an action figure is amusing.
-The level design is largely corridors broken up by puzzles and the «secret areas» are fairly obvious and much more like hidden areas in Half Life 2 or any other modern FPS rather than Duke Nukem 3D’s hidden stuff behind false walls and hard to find areas that were often at about a dozen per level instead of the one or two we get now.
-Duke Nukem isn’t about graphics, but the game looks pretty dated and the texture size varies from object to object, so some look crisp while others are a blurry mess. The blurry objects are especially apparent when you are shrunk because they will be right in your face.
-A few areas, like the casino, just felt poorly designed.
-Checkpoint saves in a PC game are always annoying, though the checkpoints are given out very generously and the game is so easy you will rarely die anyway.
Overall the game just doesn’t feel like the sequel to Duke Nukem 3D. Some people will cite the two weapon limit or the auto regenerating health as the reason but I think the problem is that the level design isn’t at all the same. Though Duke Nukem 3D had its share of corridors, many of the levels were sprawling, feeling like small chunks of a city and you had to explore it, something Duke Nukem Forever lacks.
55% Reviews
11.5 Years AgoOfficial IGN Review
55%No Platform Specified
Duke Nukem is an icon of mid-1990s video game culture – brash, vulgar and committed to the art of the one-liner, like a twelve-year old boy with internet access. His association with Duke Nukem Forever’s extended development cycle has propelled him to legendary status, attaching to him an undeserved significance.
Duke Nukem Forever isn’t a revitalization of the early days of the first-person shooter genre or a middle-finger to the increasingly complex and sophisticated nature of videogame entertainment. It’s a muddled, hypocritical exercise in irritation with solid shooting mechanics and decent encounter design. There’s some dumb fun to be had in Duke Nukem Forever, but the game tries hard to ensure it’s only fleeting.
50% Reviews
4 Months AgowaThiouZ
50%Xbox One
5/10
1.5 Years Agotheworstguy
50%PC
can be fun sometimes
+Pros
+great gunplay
+decent voice-acting at least for Duke
+some jokes and easter-eggs are funny
+opening is awesome
+good level-variety
-Cons
-story is dog-shit
-offensive humor and representation of woman such as the Hive level
-awful graphics
-level-design is a downgrade compared to 3D with less exploration and being more a linear shooter
-turret and vehicle sections are awful
-some bad boss-fights
-difficulty spikes
5.
5 Years Agosilversurfpunk
50%PlayStation 3
No game could live up to the hype that this game had. However I went into this without the hype and found a mediocre game with some bright points. The very first level is a great way to start this game. It lets the player mess around and have fun at their own pace. Then it gets boring, until you get to the strip club which is another level that lets you enjoy things at your own pace. The meat of the game is boring, but there are some decent moments. Additionally I think that Duke Nukem as a franchise is sort of a parody of the shooters in that era. The first one is a mega man clone, the second is a doom clone, and this one is a cod clone. Duke is supposed to take the format of popular titles, add his character and «witty» references and boom you have a Duke Nukem game. The only reason this game sucks so badly is because its a product of its time (and Duke’s misogynistic jokes are no longer relevant or well played).
7.
5 Years AgoDantes_Typhoon
50%Xbox 360
*5/10*
2/3-Graphics (how the game looks)
1/3-Story (How entertaining the game is)
2/3-Ease of use/Technical gameplay (how the game feels)
0/1-Replay-ability (will I play it again?)
40% Reviews
6 Years Agowestracer
40%PC
awesome game
10.5 Years AgoDigitalFrog
40%Xbox 360
A Hollow example of a classic Game! Boring missions, Boring levels, Boring enemies. The few moments of funny jokes and nostalgia can’t take away from the Horribly flawed game that is Duke Nukem Forever! Why 4? Why not 0? The Game plays, is not broken and does what it says on the case. I can see why 3Drealms never finished the game. It’s only value is nostalgia…
30% Reviews
2 Months AgoPrivate
30%PC
The Alien Hive level might actually be one of the worst video game levels I’ve ever had the misfortune of playing through.
Play Duke Nukem 3D instead. While this is certainly more playable than most terrible games, you should avoid it.
2 Years AgoLocalAutist
30%PC
Remember when shooters were not trash
2.5 Years AgoPrivate
30%PC
It’s a generic early 2000s corridor/wave-based shooter that relies almost entirely on nostalgia to get its very limited appeal.
When I started playing I didn’t get the hate, it starts mediocre and the humor wasn’t funny to me, but that’s subjective. Later on, however, you get a bad driving-mission, an extremely bad swimming mission, various missions where it’s too dark to see without duke-vision (their name for nightvision) but also too bright with duke-vision.
I got lost more than once, but I just listened to the load-screen tip: «when you get stuck, you can always look up a walkthrough on the internet.» That perfectly sums up the game, while it’s meant as a joke, it also shows they knew people would get stuck.
The boss-fights are okay, but the fact that you can only damage them with explosives makes them tedious. A rocket launcher carries 5 rockets, so after 5 shots you have to run to the ammo crate to restock. Bosses take 50+ shots, so fun… I guess?
I got this in a bundle, so I’m not that disappointed, but I wouldn’t recommend paying more than a couple of dollars for this, and that is only if you like the early 2000s type of shooter with some pubescent humor thrown in.
4 Years AgoLv25_Magikarp
30%Xbox 360
Meh.
5.5 Years AgoBeyondModern
30%PC
The gameplay isn’t the absolute worst thing in the world. It’s just really boring. Not a lot goes on. You can ignore enemies at some points in the game without any real reason to fight them. The writing is abysmal and unfunny. I could write jokes and dialog only slightly better than this within the 3 hours I spent playing this game, compared to their 3 years of development, or 15 years if you would like to pretend that this was anything near the original vision for a Duke 3D sequel was.
9.5 Years AgoGilJaysmith
30%PC
This is, as you might expect, pretty bad.
20% Reviews
1 Day AgoPrivate
20%PC
It was bad. We all know it was bad. The only reason I didn’t give it a 1 is because it worked.
7 Months Agontylerwetrust
20%PC
Game sucked, not horrible, just boring and not fun. I’m down for stupid ridiculous fun, this is not it.
5.5 Years AgoDrizzy
20%Xbox 360
This game is freaking terrible. Pretty much any other game is better than this.
6.5 Years Agomanicpunk
20%Xbox 360
This game is fucking awful. It’s not funny, it looks terrible, it pisses me off and it sucks. The action is boring, standard generic guns. The graphics look older than they are. The gameplay is boring broken up with annoying set pieces. The boss fights are easy. the story is dumb. Not worth playing for any reason other than nostalgia and you will be pissed off if you play it for nostalgia alone.
9 Years AgoTaroYamada
20%PC
Despite my low score I’d honestly still suggest playing the game, I view it as something of a museum of design concepts over the years caused by its long dev cycle.
Also, Duke’s still a great character.
10% Reviews
2 Years AgoDrizzay_D
10%Xbox 360
lol no
6.5 Years AgoChosenGozen
10%PC
One of the worst games ever made
10+ years in development hell
Extremely dated graphics
Awful plot
Awful gameplay
1/10 please uninstall
10 Years AgoBlackMageIV
10%PlayStation 3
This is the worst game I have played in a long time, if ever. The beginning mission is pretty cool but then the game is miserable from there on.
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Night of the chief editor — hail to the chief editor, baby! — Duke Nukem 3D — Games — Gamer.
ru: social network for gamers
Night of the chief editor — hail to the chief editor, baby!
Oh, and good old Duke Nukem!
The action is peppy, you can remember a lot of cool things about shooters, but they lacked charisma before. The same marine from Doom — the guy may be cool, but gray as a mouse. Whether it’s the image of Duke — and he will decorate the shootout with a red word, and the big naughty one — is not averse to being distracted from reprisals against enemies on an attraction, refreshing his throat with a beer, in the end he doesn’t forget about charmers — his life is seething.
Prepared material on the theme of old games, gladly refreshed my memories in Duke Nukem 3D — how great it is to kick a pig digger’s boot, pour lead from a monster’s shotgun. Yes, the codes are not very nice to use, but the hooligan hero and the frivolous plot of the game fit perfectly into the opportunity to treat yourself — you give all the weapons and all the cartridges and shoot as much as you like!
Although Duke Nukem Forever disappointed me because of the long wait, I like it too.
True, it would be great to play it too in such a way as to completely relax — otherwise Duke turned out to be somehow awkward, it’s a shame to die because of a trifle.
Where can you find such a miracle… there are trainers for games that don’t have codes. It would be necessary to turn on such a trainer, arrange plenty of chaos.
Let this one be…
Oh. Why did it get dark?.. Did they turn off the light?.. It’s good that I’ve already done the work and won’t lose anything, but what a nuisance, huh!.. wait, am I lying down?.. Did I faint?.. well quite see pasted — it’s time to take a vacation.
In general, everything is somehow strange — there is no city noise.
Where am I?..
***
Suddenly the floor disappeared and the editor-in-chief flew down. He did not even have time to get scared: an amazing view opened up to his eyes, not at all similar to his native Russia of the middle lane, and the fall quickly ended with a slightly hard landing on the roof of a high-rise hotel.
After making sure that he hadn’t broken anything, our fellow feller cautiously got up. Yes, and the legs seem to be intact — they hold. Now it was possible to look around and solve the first question — where did he go?..
Judging by the characteristic desert landscape covered with dusty red stone, and the city in the middle of this desert… Las Vegas?.. How did this happen. In an instant, change locations, it turns out he was teleported? ..
As unbelievable as it may be, the reality is here in front of him! This fact can only be accepted. How he will return home — can be decided later. Now it would be nice to find a way to get off the roof — the sun is pretty hot. At the same time it will be a good opportunity to see new places, for sure! In the end, I didn’t even have to pay for airfare. You have to see the positives in everything. ABOUT! And what will he live on here?..
Glavred hurriedly began to feel his pockets and at that moment realized that he was no longer him.
The body felt not my own, and my legs — they were wearing different clothes and shoes. If there were a mirror nearby, he would immediately see the changes in his own face. But there was no mirror. But there was a wallet. And it has something like a badge with a photo of a smugly grinning blonde, with a characteristic square jaw and sunglasses. This is Duke Nyukem — the character of the game. That is, then it turns out that he is Duke Nukem? .. But then he is not in real America? ..
Night of the chief editor — hail to the chief editor, baby!
Night of the chief editor — hail to the chief editor, baby!
Still not believing his eyes, the chief editor was even about to feel his own face. But he held back. Still, the real Duke Nukem does not behave like that. And what if someone is watching him now? .. They might suspect something was wrong. Until he figured out everything that happened, you need to try to keep someone else’s role suddenly inherited.
-Mr. Nukem, there you are! he heard suddenly from behind him. A young military man approached him. — Sir, everything is ready in your room, should I inform you that you are late? ..
The editor-in-chief hesitated for a moment — he doesn’t know spoken English so well, what if his accent gives it away?.. But then he realized — he easily understood the speaker, as if it were his native language! So you can take a chance: probably he will be understood just as well.
-It’s good that you warned… boy! I’ve been enjoying the view and now I’m going back to my room.
The military man saluted, turned around and went to one of the exits to the roof. Glavred-Duke Nyukem went after him — it would be foolish to get lost in a hotel where he seemed to have settled a long time ago!
His number turned out to be just like in beautiful films about a cool life. Spacious and with its own bar, quality lacquered furniture, large window. Yes, a person sometimes quickly gets used to new — even very unexpected and unusual — circumstances, and continues to enjoy life.
And the editor-in-chief had something to rejoice about: not only did he become a real macho, this macho is loved in this world, he is rich — how many opportunities are open to him now! editor-in-chief While he was busy in the bar, he did not notice the appearance of a charming brunette in the room. She quietly defiled and stood at the bar. Glavred finished a simple cocktail … and shuddered in surprise when he saw her. Luckily for him, the lady didn’t seem to notice.
— Mr. Nukem, maybe I came in vain?
-What’s wrong, dear?.. — the editor-in-chief tried to pull himself together, but scolded for a shameful mistake.
-You asked to come at this time, give you a show. — reminded the brunette.
-Yes, of course. So I just prepared a drink for this occasion. — the chief editor was found. — So, we can start. If you don’t need to treat yourself to a bar before the show…?” he added hastily, just in case.
— Don’t worry about it.
The brunette stood up and walked gracefully to the door across from the bar.
The editor followed. There was a small private room in which a subdued light burned, there was a small comfortable sofa and a stage was set up with a pole. Oh yes — the editor-in-chief smiled contentedly — ahead of him promises to be the coolest vacation of his life! With him came a certain high-ranking military man, perhaps even a colonel. Glavred pricked up his ears — it looks like the sweet vacation was postponed.
— Mr. Nukem, it’s good to be on the spot. the Colonel turned to him loudly. — Our units all this time successfully continued to finish off the remnants of strangers. But recently, communication with one of the units was lost. We fear the worst. Corporal Jones will help you collect the necessary equipment and get to the area where that squad was supposed to work. America and planet Earth are counting on you, Mr. Nukem!
-It will be done, I’ll kick the asses of strangers if they are there! — the editor-in-chief tried to make his exclamation sound militant enough, not hysterical.
The Colonel nodded in satisfaction and marched out of the room. Corporal Jones turned all his attention to the editor-in-chief. Well — there is nothing to do! .. We must move. It’s worth starting at least with checking how he will be able to shoot.
-Well, boy, take me to your armory. Give me the guns, and let me shoot them — make sure the fly is not hit. — although the editor-in-chief thought the joke was pathetic and forced, the corporal laughed approvingly.
-Mr. Nukem, wouldn’t you like to take your personal weapon on a mission? ..
Damn it! If there is a cache of weapons in this room, then he must find it, or how else to get out of an uncomfortable position? ..
-I would not want to dirty him in this fight. It’s time to replenish the collection with new guns. — the chief editor was found.
It looks like the corporal arranged such an answer. And they went to the shooting range with a military warehouse.
***
To the joy of the editor-in-chief, he discovered that in addition to his intuitive knowledge of English, he inherited from Duke Nukem not only his body and physical strength, but also his inherent reflexes, reaction speed and combat skills.
In any case, although in his life the chief editor held a real military weapon for the first time, he now managed to shoot without a miss and knew how to hold a weapon and cope with the recoil from shooting.
Well, it turns out that he really became Duke Nukem — the idol of this virtual America, the dream of all women, the darling of fate, a charming egoist, whose whims everyone is ready to fulfill. But at the same time, he also has a job, and if his job is to beat monsters, he can handle it too. All the makings for that are with him.
***
Nyukem costs an entire army, and you can deliver it with one helicopter — a real benefit! And so he ended up in the area, which he now explored in search of traces of the missing group or signs of an enemy located here. The surroundings evoked a certain feeling of deja vu in the editor-in-chief: all these rocks, the blue of the sky with the blinding sun at its zenith — just like in Half-Life … oh-ho-ho, come on — you are now cooler than Freeman.
He was a silent man, and Duke can at least grumble.
The Editor-in-Chief made sure that he is getting used to the role of Duke Nukem better — he himself can sometimes stumble, be frightened of something, get confused, but the nature of the nuclear duke has tremendous energy, and in which case other people’s reflexes start working. The warm-up at the shooting range cheered up the editor-in-chief, but now he was eager to start a real fight in order to understand if he would be afraid of monsters /? .. Still, it’s one thing to see them in the game — and even as a child he was afraid of opponents from games about Duke, and the fact that games with humor, I realized much later — in reality, these creatures, bared with fangs, roaring and growling, I suppose would have scared anyone.
Here is the squad’s temporary camp. More precisely, what was left of him.
Yes, it looks like there was a serious carnage here.
I didn’t want to see someone’s corpses, and the editor-in-chief went on as soon as possible — we need to deal with the monsters and report to the colonel — let the headquarters decide what to do next.
… the appearance of the enemy was preceded by a strange sound — teleportation! Not having time to get scared, the editor-in-chief threw up a SPAS-12 shotgun and put the unfortunate stranger to rest.
Night of the chief editor — hail to the chief editor, baby!
Night of the chief editor — hail to the chief editor, baby!
UV Adrenaline greatly cheered up the editor-in-chief. To replace the nervous tension, in anticipation of the enemy, the valiant ardor and excitement of the battle began to come. In addition, the enemies fell like a bucket: fanged monsters teleported here and there, fat men with rocket launchers flew from somewhere, but Duke Nukem rushed forward, sweeping away everyone in his path and generously showering strangers with shots.
N-na!.. With a squeal and a wheeze from a boot, the monster flew into the gorge.
Yes, he likes this job!
***
It is not known how long this dance of death lasted — he managed to shoot the arsenal taken with him, and already used the trophy cannons of strangers.
He did not know how far or where he had gone in the heat of battle. But suddenly the opponents ended. The last pig digger with his head blown clean fell off his jetbike.
There was a brief silence.
And then he appeared in front of the chief editor — a healthy, octopus-like monster. In addition to the tentacles, there were some devices on it, some of them could definitely be weapons.
So that’s the boss of the villainous invaders of the Earth. Well — away, dear! The chief editor immediately came up with a simple plan of action: the last jetbike managed not to get damaged, so he saddled this miracle technique and turned around, gaining altitude. Wow — he seems to know how to operate this thing! In the meantime, the monster had already opened fire with some kind of energy weapon, but the editor-in-chief deftly wagged from side to side and so far avoided being hit by himself. Having circled around and assessed the enemy, he went up with a candle, at the same time taking out a couple of captured mines from behind his back (only Duke Nyukem could not be afraid that he would be blown up by a mine!), Hooked them with their holders to a jetbike and activated the fuses, after which he turned around and sent the jetbike at the monster, accelerating the car more and more.
The editor-in-chief himself jumped off the car and landed quite successfully in a group. The device slammed into the target and an explosion blossomed a moment later. The neighborhood was filled with a wild roar, full of pain and resentment, but the creature was still alive, although it suffered: several tentacles were completely torn off.
What else can get you?..
The editor-in-chief studied the battlefield and found several grenades. It was probably useless to just throw them at the monster, but to get close and shove them down his throat is the most effective and, moreover, in Duke’s style!.. The pain inflicted on him seemed to make it harder for the monster to aim, so now he was feverishly pouring fire all around and swinging his remaining tentacles. Having made several tackles under the shells rushing overhead and jumping over the tentacles like a real parkour player, the editor-in-chief successfully reached the stranger and unceremoniously clung to his carcass, climbed up to some semblance of a head.
The most important thing in this head was the gaping and roaring mouth, into which, as if into a pocket, grenades flew, with torn checks. Glavred again jumped to the ground, and behind him the unlucky invader of the Earth was torn to pieces.
Here it is — his triumph!.. The editor-in-chief smiled contentedly and turned on the connection via the earpiece, which had been with him all this time. I reported to the colonel and began to wait for my return home, looking forward to a noble celebration in honor of this victory.
The helicopter of the armed forces has arrived, now he will return to his hut and have a party…
-Mr. Nukem, great work! shouted the colonel approvingly over the noise of the engine. — your next mission is completed, on behalf of the whole Earth — thank you for your service! ..
«Mission Accomplished»
Flash.
I… I’m at home?!.. Why, how?.. No, there would be so many more cool things to come! Maybe I was delirious?..
What was it…
Eh… such pupae remained in that matrix.
Night of the chief editor — hail to the chief editor, baby!
Night of the chief editor — hail to the chief editor, baby!
About wagering in OSR / Blog them. Acwellen / Imaginaria
Achtung, there are a lot of letters ahead. More than it was last time. A lot more.
Special thanks to users Angon, Nalia and flannan for their help in identifying and asking questions for the article.
Introduction
On the net, I have come across the opinion that in NRI, according to old traditions, it is either impossible, or problematic, or undesirable to win back your characters. Such an opinion often led to prejudice against OSR as a phenomenon, sometimes so deep that some seriously refused to consider them role-playing games. Of course, I cannot pass by such a topic, so let’s try to analyze this problem and come to some conclusions.
It feels like discussions about the concept of “acting out” in RPG are only slightly shorter than the actual hobby. This is partly due to differences in the focus of the gameplay of certain systems, partly due to the individual preferences of different game groups. However, the main stumbling block in such discussions, no doubt, is the definition of clear boundaries of the term.
And indeed: acting out is such a multifaceted and context-dependent concept that individual participants in the discussion can put different meanings into it, even if they agree on a specific definition. Therefore, let’s do this to you: I will try to derive a definition based on the meaning that most often invested in this concept by most of my interlocutors, and in the future we will talk about the concept of acting out in this vein. I do not in the least pretend to the only correct interpretation of the word (all the more so, everyone understands perfectly well that there is none in principle), and, even more so, to the “evenness” of my definition.
Whoever needs it will in any case find something to get to the bottom of, and whoever doesn’t need it will understand what I mean anyway.
So, roleplaying — is making decisions during the game in accordance with the declared image, values and background of the character in isolation from the metagame . Thus, a good and correct role-playing is when a player, making a request for an action, is primarily guided by the appropriateness of it from the position of his character, and only then by game-mechanical or rational efficiency, as well as some kind of extra-setting information.
Conflict between metagame and roleplaying
The first remarks appear already at the stage of formulation. Indeed, the emphasis on the player’s skills instead of the character’s skills, the danger of making deliberately wrong decisions for the sake of the image — all this is meta-game information that forces you to act not from the position of how the character would act directly, but from the position of how it would be most reasonable to act in this particular case.
And, at first glance, such a situation really harms the roleplaying and puts additional limits. There are a lot of things we shouldn’t do because «that’s what my character would do» if we want the character to survive. We cannot afford unnecessary words and unnecessary actions at critical moments, because his life and the lives of his party members are at stake, no matter how artistic and appropriate they may look. We have to adapt to the game by making a completely meta-game decision to act in a certain way so as not to spoil the game for ourselves or others.
You’ve already looked at the translation of the article at the link, haven’t you? If not, at least take a look and then come back. If so, then you probably guessed where I’m driving now. Think about it: after all, when playing games, we do it all the time anyway. This is because, according to the Big Model, the whole game is based on such a thing as a social contract. And, while there are critics of the Big Model, as a rule, the importance of the social contract is not disputed by anyone.
Everything that happens inside the game is the result of the social interaction of all those gathered at the game table. And the most important part of adequate social interaction is “not to be goats in relation to each other” ©. Not to be goats means to show attention and empathy towards others, and, as a result, to make mutual concessions and compromises.
Thus, all actions and all decisions made by the character depend on such things as:
- Table manners;
- Relationships between players;
- Separate agreements between them.
And this is the minimum. Obviously, insisting on sticking to your character’s line of action against all odds, even when it may lead to general frustration with the game or even conflict, is not a good idea, and it’s not for me to explain it to you. And the fact that you and your friends gathered at the gaming table not to get offended at each other or argue, but just to have a good time playing together is a real, malicious and terry metagame that has a direct impact on the game.
Do you understand what I mean?
In fact, in the course of the game at any given time we use the metagame (I will repeat this more than once), and the social contract here is just one of the factors in its application. Some of the metagame stuff is obvious, such as the use of game mechanics or even props. We don’t even think about many of them and support them intuitively, such as, for example, the framework of game styles and genres. In more detail about the influence of the metagame on the game, the public with the laconic name «Dungeons & Dragons» wrote, so we will not linger here for a long time. Let’s just fix the following: a metagame is an essentially valueless phenomenon, while its impact on the gameplay can be not only negative, but also purely positive, and an adequate game without a metagame as such is impossible in principle.
Now let’s try to figure out where is the line between a metagame that enhances the gaming experience and a metagame that destroys it? Where is the good, useful, useful metagame, and where is the evil, wrong, and harmful one?
In short, not clear.
If for a long time, then it is impossible to answer this question objectively — everything, as always, rests on personal preferences and gaming traditions of a group of people gathered at the table. However, in discussions with other players and hosts, I have identified the following most commonly encountered aspects that apply directly to OSR are metagame restrictions that determine the focus of the game, the vulnerability of characters and potentially high mortality, which reduces the player’s interest in the character’s character, as well as a large the influence of meta-game information that influences the character’s decisions.
Metagame restrictions
Let’s get back to the issue of limits. A few times
(that’s kind of a vague euphemism for «thrice»)
I’ve heard things like «OSR restricts roleplaying because you can’t fully play as a stupid/careless/desperate/whatever character.
Like, it imposes a strictly defined gameplay of methodically wandering through the dungeons in search of loot ”… And, you know, in fact, this is a claim that I don’t even have anything to object to, because, in the strict sense, it is.
Judged from this point of view, then OSR really limits wagering in this regard, and arguing with this is pointless and stupid. Here you won’t be able to go, for example, as a dashing barbarian, dashing everyone with a valiant swing — the character will either be killed, or he will die on a trap himself. You won’t be able to go as a professional “dungeon delver”, able to bypass any troubles by throwing, straight to the treasures — such mechanics are not provided in such systems. Therefore, those who are not ready for the style of the game, for example, about the same “homeless killers”, prone to pixel hunting and anxiously feeling their way with a stick, are unlikely to find something interesting in it for themselves if they themselves do not want to.
Nevertheless, in this regard, I don’t see it as quite fair to single out a certain gaming tradition, since limiting to certain limits is the essence and meaning of any style, genre or idea. After all, you, in turn, will not play a stormtrooper character with a minigun at the ready, if you play horror or a psychological detective, thereby spitting on the laws of the genre and violating the intent of the game? Of course, a character can have the background of some veteran and even have the corresponding game mechanics, but it will not be Duke Nyukem, which we have already conceived. And if so, then the sense of such a character will be about the same as from the aforementioned barbarian with a penchant for suicide.
All I’m trying to say is that OSR isn’t the only play style that imposes them: any game is always dominated by style, genre, and setting boundaries. And, if you learn to treat these restrictions like any other, in other systems created for games in certain styles and genres for those who are interested in these styles and genres, this will cease to be a limitation and turn into a guideline for how to conduct such a game.
game — as it is, in fact, conceived.
Any particular style of play (and even any game made in a certain style) provides a very clear and delineated field for playing in general and wagering in particular, and, strictly speaking, the field provided by OSR is not narrower or more cramped than others. How would a character act, desperately longing to achieve something, to escape from the bleak peasant or burgher everyday life and acquire wealth and fame? How would a character act who, by all means, wanted to survive in a dangerous situation that ruined more than one self-confident proud man? And what will accompany all this? The answers to these questions can generate a variety of events and provide a really huge scope for wagering.
We do not perceive the process of playing about vampire intrigues in a secret vampire society, where they fight in vain for the remnants of humanity, but over time inevitably move away from the human, limiting? No, it’s just a game with a certain idea — we can only want or not want to play it.
Just try to treat OSR the same way.
Interest in wagering
By the way, about “want to play it”. Or rather, even, «want to win it back.» At one time, Redrick spoke here on this topic, but many, picking up the thesis taken out of context that “a character is just a layer between the player and the game world”, began to completely misinterpret this aspect for themselves.
I understand very well how such an attitude grows. Like it or not, one of the main features of OSR is that the character is mortal. And at the initial stages of the game, he, no matter how ridiculous it may sound, is very mortal. Understanding the degree of risk, most simply will not want to make high stakes, namely, to risk characters that have been nurtured and carefully developed for so long. That is why in most cases the characters are created quite schematically.
You see, what the point is… I’m not going to claim that it was intended — probably, such an approach was born by accident — but OSR professes a rather specific approach to character creation.
Its general meaning lies in the fact that at the moment when you sit down to play with an already filled character sheet, the character himself not yet created . Do you get it? That is, he is, but for now he is just a person about whom we, as a player, really do not know anything. The maximum is who he is, where he comes from and what he wants, in a couple of words. However, this is enough, you can start playing.
Then he starts going through certain events. We, and therefore him, will inevitably have to make choices in the course of them. And having made a decision, we can try to understand more deeply why he decided this way, explaining to himself his act. And, if some events show his attitude to certain things, then others can form it. Faced with something, he creates his own opinion about it. The character may have a new phobia or object of hatred. Or, on the contrary, he may begin to trust certain persons or even things.
The essence of the thesis that “the character is just a layer between the player and the game world” is not that OSR obliges us to play with cardboard.
The bottom line is that a character is simply not created retroactively through elaborate backstory. Instead, we are throwing into the game only a layout, a character blank. And what kind of character will turn out, we are already starting to find out for ourselves during the game, overcoming certain dangers, going through certain events and interacting with the game world through it. And even then he acquires personality.
And, unlike the prescribed quest, all this is not what we thought up for him in our head, but what we went through together with him side by side. All this contributes to a strong fusion with the character, and these events themselves often acquire even greater value for us than those that we could come up with on our own. Even with a literary skill.
But how can one begin to develop a character’s personality when the game actually forces us to start from the metagame by making decisions for the character?
Meta-game information in decision making
Finally, we come to the most delicious.
After all, the terms “metagame” and “winning back” have long and firmly been for some leaders and players opposite both in meaning and in meaning. Indeed: making decisions based on extra-game entities and playing from the position of things happening in a common imaginary space, at first glance, really seem to be mutually exclusive concepts. However, let’s try to dig a little deeper: if everything was so simple, we would not be sitting here right now.
A character’s decision, be it logical or absurd, always starts with the player’s decision, their understanding of the situation, the character himself, the outlined path of the character’s development (if any) and many, many other things that come directly from … the metagame. Once again, look carefully and record: whatever the character does within the overall imaginary space, the decision is made by the player, not the character . In any unit of time, while the character is under the control of the player, it is the player who decides how the character should act, in which direction to develop this character, and what exactly will be appropriate from the position of the image being played.
Roleplaying, from its general direction to specific actions, comes from completely meta-game decisions — player decisions. The character could perform one act or another, based on some of his motives and reasons, internal conflict or unshakable confidence — this is what is in the general imaginary space. However, which strings of the character faltered in the process, how it will affect him and whether it will affect him, and, in fact, why the player decided that this hero needs to do this — all this is already out of it.
“Yes, you can say anything about anything! According to this logic, in general, everything in the game is a metagame!” You will rightly be indignant, but give me one more minute. Believe me, I didn’t wrap up all this for the sake of beautiful sophism, it will be important for what I will describe further. Now I will tell you about one thing that you are guaranteed to use during the game, but probably you could not even think about it. Let’s call it conditionally as «associated gameplay».
I think I am familiar with the term «associated mechanics». If not, then in a nutshell: this is an element of the game that has a connection (or association) between the game-mechanical essence and the essence in a common imaginary space. For example, a character must roll a lucky roll on a d20 to help a friend get poisoned, and the higher his medicine skill, the easier it is for him to do so. The mechanics are quite associated: the number in medicine reflects the character’s competence, the roll — the process of helping, the dropped value — the fact of success.
On the other hand, we have an example of a barbarian’s rage from any edition of D&D. If the rage mechanic itself is associated with the fact that combat rage gives a heated barbarian strength in battle, then the fact that it is severely limited to the number of times a day introduces an additional layer of metagame reasoning: “Can I get angry now? No, I’d better save it just in case there’s another encounter before the end of the day!” It is clear that in battle the barbarian will not think about such complex philosophical issues as “range management”, therefore this aspect of the mechanics can be considered “dissociated”, since it does not find connection with any detail inside the world, but exists in isolation from him.
Now let’s expand this concept to the area not only of mechanics, but of metagame aspects as such. That is, based on the definition above, an associated game element will be one that has a connection between a meta-game entity and an entity in a common imaginary space. Thus, considering the subject of analysis from this point of view, we have that the player’s decisions, which seem correct to him from the position of the character, become the character’s decisions within the game. This is where the connection «meta-game entity — in-game entity» will be.
Now let’s try adding one small variable. We play a cold-blooded killer whose party is in trouble for the third time because of a halfling thief who constantly messes up. Maybe the player is not lucky on the cubes, or maybe he is just inexperienced and often makes mistakes, it doesn’t matter. And here a dilemma arises: cut off a couple of fingers of a little asshole so that it would be disrespectful? Logical decision. Set up an accident for him to get rid of the burden? Also quite.
And, in fact, in some parties, in the case of mutual agreements, both options are acceptable.
But now we’re looking at a host who will have to resolve the conflict between your characters — consider taking sides, even though he will try to do everything with an open mind and by the rules. We are looking at a player who is, in fact, a great guy, whom you would not like to upset the least. We look at other players who will have to wait for the denouement if we want to solve the halfling issue quietly or face to face. And what are we doing?
We find the third option and make it justified from the position of the character. The killer may begin to share experience with the halfling. “To hell with caring — our lives depend on you! Listen and look carefully — there won’t be a second time.» The character will begin to develop in a new direction and will receive a new facet. If we do not want this and have decided to firmly win back the unscrupulous villain, we can start the conflict so that the party has the opportunity to keep him from radical actions.
Or limit yourself to threats. There are a lot of possibilities — and all of them can be acceptable from the position of the character, if the player so desires.
That’s what I meant when I said you were guaranteed to use it while playing. When the metagame limits us or inclines us to some specific action, even to some extent unjustified, we make it justified by a voluntaristic decision, explaining why the character could do it, either by opening the character from a new side, or by organically inscribing his act into the existing one. concept.
Despite the somewhat clumsy example above, in fact, we do this so often during the game that we don’t notice it most of the time. Like, you know, something at the level of everyday lies — it’s no secret to anyone that we lie all the time, many times a day. Even the most honest of us. And, as with lies, the only thing left for us here is to simply accept it as inevitable. Indeed, there are many completely textbook examples: “We have reasons to go to another area, but we will not rush to do it now, because the host did not have time to prepare it, and we still have something to do here”, “We ourselves must look for motivation for the character to have adventures specifically in this adventure with this particular party”, “We found reasons to take a break to end the game session at a convenient point from which we can continue next time” and the like.
Familiar, right?
And now, actually, what we are here for now is an example from OSR: the party is in front of the tower, and one player touches the snake-shaped handle. The pen turns into a snake, bites him, he fails his saving throw vs. poison, and dies. The player creates a new character who joins the party that decides to retreat. However, there is a problem: the player knows what the tower is and that the handle at the entrance turns into a snake, but his character does not. Logically, he shouldn’t act like he’s in the know. How to solve a problem? In the same way as in any of the examples above — it is right to beat.
First, the completely banal «the party told the character on the way.» Most often, this is enough to restore the logic of what is happening and give a new character a reason to act on the basis of information known to the player. But, even if there were no party, and the character would travel alone … then, upon arriving at the place, the new adventurer will find the corpse of the previous one with signs of poisoning near the door and draw the obvious conclusion.
Problem solved again.
Now let’s abstract directly from the trap and everything that I wrote in my previous article, that’s not the point. The bottom line is that there is some kind of meta-game information — knowledge about the adventure that the player has, but which the character does not. And, since the player cannot “unsee what he saw”, we are doing it in such a way as to connect the meta-game information with the game information, leveling the problem. In some situations, this may require wit and ingenuity, but nothing that cannot be mastered.
Conclusion
So, let’s summarize in the form of theses:
- Metagame as a phenomenon can be both harmful and useful for the game in general and wagering in particular. Its destructive or, conversely, beneficial effect on the process is entirely due to the situation and context, including subjective ones.
- The boxes that the characters are placed in when playing in the old school style are the same boxes that restrict any other style, genre, setting, or any other game idea or tradition.
As with any other games, we can accept them as we feel comfortable with them, or choose others over them. - The tradition of creating sketchy characters without a detailed background does not oblige us to play with doodles. Instead, the story and personality of the character is supposed to be shaped as the game progresses through the decisions made and the circumstances passed through.
- Any of our decisions that determine the course of action and character development are metagame by default. We ourselves decide why the character does certain things based on both our ideas about the character and our desires or external circumstances. The main thing is how it was played during the game.
The conclusion, in fact, from all this is simple and not at all new. It is not the system or the gaming paradigm that decides where there is a place for wagering, and where there is not, but only how we ourselves are set up to wager in these specific circumstances and how it is customary at a particular gaming table.
