Destiny 2 will NEVER be an Esport, so why treat it like one? : DestinyTheGame
First and foremost, I’ve been playing Destiny since D1 Launch. I’ve been through the few Ups and overwhelming downs on both console and now PC. I love the IDEA of Destiny and hope that the game will soon become what it was first promised to be. This is here for open discussion and hopefully a gathering ground for all Destiny Fans.
Now I’m just a guy who isn’t anyone but I’ve had my fair dabble in eSports. I’ve played competitively for more than 11 years in FPS games. I’ve also shoutcasted for ESL and hosted a couple online tournaments as well. I served as an ambassador for the players in the gaming community to both ESL and the GMs.
With this in mind, I can 100% say that Destiny 2 will never become an eSport and that a competitive PVP system, outside of the internal games comp PVP of course, will not be initialized nor supported by the general public in its current state. I also do not believe that is the course that D2’s PVP system should take. My opinion is that Destiny 2 thrives the most when it is in a PVE environment and that PVP is strictly supplemental to that core pillar.
My point here is, D2 should start taking PVP less seriously and focus on the core PVE element of the game. PVP for me was the most fun when they unintentionally let a broken gun slip through (Prometheus Lens 1st week for those living under a rock). Finally feeling powerful in D2 was extremely satisfying and reminded me of the days of D1. Give us back the Space Wizard / Gun Lord / Unbreakable Demi God feel and let the community coast on that simply because PVP in its current state is the biggest hassle for my milestones. I’m literally regretting every minute in PVP.
Bungie please, I too wish that you would look at your first promises before D1 was released and return to your core structure. I know that with a better D2 the community will thrive and PVP will inherently become better because of your PVE choices.
TLDR; PVP was better broken to give us that powerful feeling.
Since D2 will never be an eSport, focus on PVE and let PVP thrive with the slightly unbalanced weapons
Edit: I think this topic was taken the wrong direction. What I was really aiming for is, PVP in its current state is not fun at all. And since D2 has no viability as an eSport, we should just have raw weapon power, shorter cooldowns, frags everywhere, chaos. The PVP in this game shouldn’t be taken seriously and should provide incentive as a supplement to the PVE system in terms of higher power level gear / chance of exotic drop for collection.
Edit2: From what I’m gathering so far on the comments is that PvP was never stressed by the producers as an eSport, which is what I assumed. However, for me, D1 was alot more enjoyable than what it is now. I would propose instead the Competitive PVP to remain as is, and let the casual PVP be more.. casual. Maybe get a best of both worlds to satisfy all tastes?
Bungie wants their mysterious new Destiny 2 follow-up to be ‘esports-ready’
❘ Published: 2021-04-16T04:29:30
❘ Updated: 2021-04-16T04:51:49
Bungie wants new IP franchise Destiny 2 follow-up to be “esports ready”.
Bungie has plans to make their mysterious new franchise, which they have suggested will live “alongside Destiny 2,” ready for competitive esports right out the gate in a bid to challenge top titles like Valorant, CSGO, and Call of Duty.
Esports forefathers Bungie may be staging a comeback.
A new job listing from Destiny 2 developers Bungie has hinted their “new franchise” — which is still shrouded in mystery — will feature competitive PvP playlists.
The new dev position, first spotted by DestinyNews on Twitter, suggests Bungie is in the market for a multiplayer systems designer for their new IP. The designer, the listing explains, will focus on building “competitive multiplayer game mechanics which provide strategic depth and opportunities for counterplay” in the title.
Bungie is looking for someone who is familiar with global gaming markets, as well as wired-in to a variety of “competitive esports and gaming landscapes.
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The role also requires a “strong understanding of map design.”
Bungie
The Destiny 2 publishers are aiming to make their new IP “esports ready” at launch.
Now, there’s relatively few details on Bungie’s new IP, but fans who have stuck with the Washington studio since the early days are certainly getting excited.
These days, Bungie has a relatively minor presence in global esports, but across the mid and late 2000s, their titles ruled the competitive scene. Halo 2, 3, and Reach were all popular games that naturally spawned monstrous esports communities, and their year-end championships often boasted hefty $300k wallets.
In fact, CDL stars like Matt ‘FormaL’ Piper, Anthony ‘Shotzzy’ Cuevas-Castro, and James ‘Clayster’ Eubanks first cut their teeth in Bungie’s juggernaut franchise.
Halo esports has returned recently, but not under Bungie.
Bungie’s interest in esports seemingly waned with the dawn of Destiny in late 2014. The title relied just as heavily on its PvE elements as it did competitive gameplay and the series’ esports scene never found its feet.
- Read More: Destiny 2 finally finds groove in Season of the Chosen
Recently, the Destiny 2 devs even all but abandoned their competitive mode, Trials of Osiris, entirely. They only re-instated the playlist last month.
Bungie
Bungie’s iconic Halo franchise laid much of the early groundwork for modern esports.
The possibility that the former Halo masterminds could actually be stepping back into the ring is certainly an exciting thought, though there may be a bit of a wait on our hands — the new IP won’t land until 2025 at the earliest.
For now, Bungie looks to be doubling down on Destiny with releases like “The Witch Queen” and “Lightfall,” as well as a secret expansion coming in 2024.
- Read More: “No plans” to ditch Destiny 2 after Lightfall, says Bungie
Expect more details on the new Bungie franchise in mid-2022, when they begin work on the title. For now, keep your eyes peeled on @TheDestinyBlog; we’ll keep you updated on all the insider info on Destiny 2 and plenty more.
Russian cybersport is going through the most difficult times — Realnoe Vremya
Sport
00:00, 04/18/2022
How the domestic CS:GO scene survives in the new realities
Professional esports, unlike traditional sports, did not ban Russian players from participating in major international tournaments. In particular, three Russian teams at once continue to fight for getting into the PGL Antwerp Major 2022, which will be held in May this year. But the situation is not so rosy, and domestic rosters still have a lot of work to do in order to fully maintain their place in the elite of the global esports community.
Prohibition on the use of the name of the organization. VP and Gambit suffer financial losses
The first tangible blow to domestic cybersport was the ban on the use of organization names in official tournaments on the professional stage. Two of Russia’s leading sports organizations suffered from this, namely Virtus.pro and Gambit, which now refer to themselves as Outsiders and Players, respectively. The names are not the most original and did not help our teams much: both teams performed below their capabilities at the last ESL Pro League and did not reach the decisive stages.
The same applies to the other Russian members of Entropiq, but their situation turned out to be a bit simpler. The Czech organization, which is Entropiq, did not kick (remove from the roster — note ed. .) players, and the guys continue to perform at all international competitions, however, without using the Russian flag. This practice has been applied to Russian athletes for more than a year at major tournaments in traditional sports and the Olympic Games, and now it has reached e-sports.
Any mention of Russia is no longer allowed, but viewers and experts who follow CS:GO understand which country certain players represent, so this ban is formal. The organization Team Spirit acted even easier, which moved its office from Russia to Serbia, also retaining a roster consisting of Russians.
The guys continue to compete at all international competitions, however, without using the Russian flag. Photo: vk.com/entropiqteam
Returning to the topic of VP and Gambit, things are getting tough for these famous teams. The ban on the use of the name does not even hit the players, but the organizations themselves, more precisely, the well-known brands in the world of eSports. Advertisers, which VP and Gambit have in abundance, also cannot place their logos on the kit and be mentioned as sponsors of these teams. Accordingly, organizations lose a lot of money from each tournament where their teams compete. Plus, we must not forget about such a seemingly secondary factor as stickers inside the game.
From one major, teams receive hundreds of thousands of dollars for the sale of their name stickers for both players and teams. And if the players can make money on this event, then the organizations cannot, and the ban on the use of the brand is to blame.
VP and Gambit may disappear from the CS:GO elite
The financial situation forces us to make not the most pleasant decisions. For several days now, there has been talk about the imminent sale of both VP and Gambit rosters, because without mentioning organizations, these are just players who go to tournaments, and maintaining one team costs a lot of money. The top players get paid accordingly, and paying them without a chance to earn can lead to financial ruin. And since the ban does not apply to players, there will be no doubt about the demand for the top squad.
Both VP and Gambit are among the top 10 teams in the world, and many will want to strengthen their team with such strong players, so a potential sale looks like the most obvious solution for organizations.
Players have been training outside of Russia for a long time, so the additional spending on their squads is now not a plus for the leaders of a commercial organization seeking to earn money, and such are VP and Gambit.
For several days now there has been talk about the imminent sale of both VP and Gambit rosters. Photo: vk.com/gambitesports
NAVI as the main factor in the problems of Russian esports
Natus Vincere has always been the flagship of the CIS esports, but in the current situation it has chosen a logical path for itself. The Ukrainian organization, which currently occupies the second place in the world ranking, contributes more than others to the fact that the Russian CS:GO scene is losing ground. It was the leadership of NAVI who became one of the initiators of the ban on the participation of Russian teams under their names in all tournaments, while retaining the opportunity for players from Russia to play. Having taken a tough stance on this issue, the «Born to Win» would have set themselves up, because in their composition three of the five players represent Russia, including Denis electronic Sharipov, a native of Kazan.
All the guys have already been offered to move to Ukraine and obtain citizenship of the country where the organization’s office is located, but not everyone is ready for this yet. The same electronic lives in Moscow with his wife and child, as does the captain of the boom4l team.
So far, the team continues to play in its current line-up, but how long it will remain unchanged is a big question. There is simply no one to replace the Russians now, because there are not so many top Ukrainian players on the world stage, and a decrease in the level of the team’s game will also lead to a weakening of the results, which NAVI is definitely not ready for. As long as the players are loyal to the actions of the management, this squad will be able to play, but the kick of Russian players is not ruled out if they disagree with the move from Russia.
While the balance between Russian and Ukrainian players remains at the core of Natus Vincere, changes are already taking place in the youth rosters of NAVI Junior and NAVI Youth — all Russian players have been kicked.
Taking into account the successful experience of signing a player from the academy, namely B1t, in the future NAVI plans to rely on their youth. At the same ESL Pro League, instead of boom4l, who fell ill with coronavirus just before the start of the tournament, a 16-year-old headtrick, a new young talent from the club’s system, played. The phenomenon is temporary, but it is likely that he will soon take a full-fledged place in the top five of the Born to Win.
Three out of five players represent Russia, including Kazan-born Denis electronic Sharipov. Photo: navi.gg
The future is uncertain. But you can look for salvation in international squads
The development of the situation harms the teams, but the players are more protected, they are not under so much pressure, because the CS:GO community is quite loyal. Russian players will always find a place in teams of any level, it’s only a matter of knowing English, and professional players are in perfect order with this. Therefore, there is a solution — since the sale of the strongest domestic players is almost inevitable, the solution lies in the teams that are ready to respond and invite the guys to their place.
A variant is possible, as with Entropiq, in which the European team will spend on a whole five, or single transfers to international squads.
Both are very likely, because the class of Russian players is high and they can strengthen a large number of teams on the pro scene. There is a chance for teams of the second or third tier to get top players and take their club to a higher level. The players themselves will be able to continue to play in all tournaments around the world, and their current leaders will be able to earn good money, and in the current conditions this is urgently needed. Everything seems to be in the black, but Russian organizations remain outside the world of eSports for a long time, and this is not only about CS:GO. In other disciplines, the same VP and Gambit are among the leading teams, and the losses will affect not only CS rosters, but also Dota plus other leading disciplines. So for now, the future of Russian e-sports is vague, and it is not known when domestic teams will be able to re-assert themselves in full.
Igor Belonogov
SportsEsports
How unexpected are the results of The International and do the favorites win at TI? — eSports on DTF
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Less than two weeks left before the long-suffering start of The International 10, the Dota 2 world championship. Fate and world problems postponed the tournament first chronologically, and then geographically. But in the end, his time has come. Bearded eSports also had a hard life, but with the return of The International, analytical and simply interesting articles about eSports are returning. Now they will come out regularly every two weeks. Well, let’s start with what we think is a rather interesting topic of The International’s predictability.
9 tournaments of this series have already passed and before each of them people tried to single out favorites and outsiders. But was it possible to do it? Which of the tournaments in this regard was the most unexpected? And was the main favorite of the tournament able to win it at least once? I will try to answer all these questions today.
Video version
For a more accurate and objective calculation, we will take the information of the last 4 championships. Since the 2016 competition, various bookmakers have turned their attention to these tournaments, and based on their average odds, we will find out which place was predicted for which team. We will also look at earlier tournaments, but with less attention.
The International 2016
First, let’s just look at how the strength of the teams was assessed before the start of the competition. The International 2016 was the first tournament organized after the start of the off-season Major tournaments, and, naturally, the champions of two of them, the OG team, were the main favorite here. Also in the top five were two European teams Liquid and Secret, and two Chinese teams represented by Newbee and Wings. The Escape team was considered the weakest team, but Americans Digital Chaos and Asians from Fnatic and TNC were also singled out among the outsiders.
What happened in the end?
As you can see, the forecast almost completely did not agree with the real result. Of course, the giant mistake with the very favorites and outsiders is especially surprising. As a measure of calculation, we took the difference between the occupied space and the intended one. Since some teams are ranked from, say, 9 to 12, then in this case we always went in favor of the predictors and considered that the team took the place closest to what it predicted. The favorite who takes 9th-12th place will be considered 9th-m, and a complete outsider 12th.
The biggest failure unexpectedly turned out to be almost all of the 5 leaders that were singled out before the start of the competition. The top 1 team OG ended up in 9th place, Liquid and Newbee fell to 7th and 9th, but the main failure of the entire tournament was Secret, who ended up in, in fact, last place. But the future champion represented by Wings was also in this 5 favorites. So you can’t call their victory completely unexpected.
But the fact that everything will turn out just like that, few would have thought.
The main successes of the tournament were the same outsider teams. Digital Chaos made it to the finals and 2nd place, Fnatic became 4th, and TNC entered the top 8. But even without these highly unexpected results, the rest of the teams’ positions also almost did not coincide with what they predicted. The only successes were Escape, which really took the last place, and Alliance, which stopped at 11th position. Otherwise, the result of the tournament as a whole was unpredictable. We calculated the average deviation from the forecast for the teams and got the final error figure of 5.19positions. Which, looking ahead, is a fairly high value.
The International 2017
Let’s move forward one year and see a new and interesting picture in 2017. The main favorites this time are EG and VP, but Liqud and OG are also among the likely winners. All Western teams. China is basically placed in the middle of the power table.
The absolute outsiders are considered the teams HR, Infamous and Execration. They don’t really believe in Team Empire either, especially considering their forced replacement at the tournament. Kerry of the Chappie team did not return their passport from the US embassy in time, and instead, Resolut1on took the 1st position, who, although he was a finalist of last year in DC, was still a stranger to the team player.
And what do we get as a result? In fact, a fairly predictable tournament with only one loud failure. The main favorite of that year in the face of EG ended up being a major failure, taking only 9th place. Breakthroughs in the tournament were two teams. This is, firstly, Team Empire, which just knocked EG out of the tournament, despite the replacement. And, secondly, these are elderly Chinese from the LGD Forever Young team. They predicted a place in the middle of the table, and they became bronze medalists. And in general, there were 3 teams from China in the 4 strongest teams.
However, the European team Liquid still became the champion. She was one of the favorites of that year, so her victory did not come as some kind of shock.
In general, looking at the overall results of the tournament, it turned out to be quite predictable. Most of the errors were within 3 places, which is pretty accurate. And although almost everywhere there could be small errors, but the overall assessment of strength before the start of the tournament and at the tournament itself approximately coincided. The average error that year was only 2.83 positions.
The International 2018
The next year gave us a somewhat similar picture in terms of team strength. The top three favorites that year were VP, Liquid and LGD. And in that exact order. All the teams performed well throughout the year, and there was little doubt about them. Outsiders were considered not only Pain and Winstrike, but also 3 Chinese teams at once: IG, VGJ.Thunder and Team Serenity.
There was little faith in the European OG team either. This team fell apart shortly before the start of the tournament, two key players left for the EG team, and they had to patch up the line-up with the team’s coach and a former player who announced a year ago that he was going on an indefinite leave from esports. Carry of the team had to move to the position of captain and support of position 5.
Well, the results of this tournament, as you probably know, turned out to be quite interesting. However, again, we almost do not see any cardinal errors in predicting the strength of teams. The failed teams go down by only 4-5 positions, and this is the main favorite of VP, which became only 5th, very strong Vici, which became only 9th, and Newbee, which should have been average, but ended up at the very bottom.
Well, the main and only breakthrough of this year, of course, was the same OG. Despite all the problems and the line-up assembled in recent days from what was at hand, they were able to show incredible skills and win the tournament, although they were predicted to be eliminated in one of the first stages.
In comparison with them, the rest of the successes are somehow not very noticeable, and, to be honest, there weren’t really any. In general, all estimates were close again, and with the exception of OG, other teams turned out to be approximately where expected. This year, the average error has fallen again and has already reached 2.61 positions.
The International 2019
And finally, the last year, in which The International could be held, has come. The four favorites this time were the Europeans Secret and Liquid, the Chinese from Vici and the CIS team VP. The past OG champions were not evaluated very well, however, remembering their unexpected success last year, they still had more faith in them and gave them a place in the middle of the table. What did we get?
The last time so far, the result was finally more unpredictable. The biggest failures were the failures of the Europeans NIP and Chaos. They were predicted places in the middle of the table, and they both took the last two places and were the first to be eliminated from the tournament. A big failure was also the failure of VP, who turned out to be only 9mi. The main favorite represented by Secret also did not perform as well as expected, but at least took a good 4th place.
Well, if we talk about successes, then two teams stand out here. The biggest success was the Peruvian team Infamous, which, being rated as the weakest team of the tournament, managed to get into the top eight. And of course, the guys from OG repeated their success again and became the first two-time champions. This time around it wasn’t as shocking as they were already seen as a pretty good team. But of course, the fact that they were the first in history to take the Aegis twice, and also twice in a row, was absolutely unexpected.
However, apart from this, many of the predictions again turned out to be quite accurate. Again, as many as 5 teams were accurately distributed in terms of strength. Among them was the finalist Liquid. So, although the tournament turned out to be more unpredictable, it did not reach the heights of The International 2016 and the average error here was equal to 3rd places.
Early The International
We won’t consider tournaments of earlier years in such detail, but I’ll say a few words about them and favorites.
In 2011, there were no predictions at all, since people saw Dota 2 for the first time at this tournament. What can we say about the strength of the teams playing this new game. In 2012, an array of tournaments had already accumulated, but the Chinese only relatively recently came to Dota 2 from the first part, so they also could not be appreciated. The teams NaVi, Zenith, CLG and EG were considered the strongest. The last two failed, but the first two performed well. But all the same, in the top 4 there were 3 Chinese teams, about which it was difficult to make predictions. However, the favorite in the person of NaVi still could not succeed and IG became the champions. In 2013, the favorites were NaVi, LGD, Alliance and TongFu. The final turned out to be quite expected, but again, we note that before the start of the tournament, NaVi were rated as a stronger team compared to Alliance. And finally, in 2014, the teams IG, DK, EG and Newbee were named the strongest teams. The main favorite in the person of IG failed and became only 7th, but all the rest ended up in the top 4, and Newbee managed to get right up to the first place. Only Vici were added to them, who were also rated well, but they predicted a place in the middle. In 2015, Secret was singled out as the undisputed favorite, but they took only 7th place. The second-placed EG team, according to forecasts, became the champion. The other group of leaders again performed well. Well, the breakthrough of the young Chinese from CDEC to the very final was the main and unexpected success at the tournament. However, they could not win, and the champion again turned out to be largely predictable.
Totals
What can be said based on the results of all this and looking at how the expected and actual results differed. In most cases, the overall strength of the teams turns out to be quite predictable and the bulk of the teams perform in accordance with what is expected of them. But in every tournament there are 3-4 teams that either fail drastically or succeed. Basically, this explains the average deviation of 3 positions for other teams. It is these 3 teams that will slightly confuse the assessments of the strength of the rest of the teams. The most unexpected result of The International tournament, as a result, is the tournament of 2016. On it, almost the entire group of leaders failed, and many of the outsiders unexpectedly succeeded. In other years, this was not the case.
Speaking of champions, since at least 2013, the main favorite has never managed to win. Sometimes they failed completely, sometimes they stayed near the first place, but did not win. But the champions themselves, in the main, were not some kind of shot teams. With the exception of OG, all the past champions have been among the main favorites in one way or another, and their victory was not something completely unbelievable.
Forecast for The International 10
Well, let’s, as a small afterword, try to make a prediction for the upcoming tournament based on the things that were previously observed in the tournament. We will also take the average opinion of bookmakers about the favorites of the tournament as a basis. We will calculate the average deviation for each of the positions of strength for all years and determine which places the teams can “conditionally” take. This is a very rough analysis, but for fun we will do it.
This time around, the Chinese team LGD is the clear favorite, but given their past history, they will almost certainly not be able to win the tournament. However, it will most likely be in the top five. The most likely contender for the championship is someone from the group Secret, EG, OG, VP. However, according to statistics, most likely, one of them will fail in this tournament and will be in the middle of the table. Also, someone from the middle peasants like Elephant or Vici can shoot. But the rest of the teams in the middle of the rankings may well perform worse than expected. It is also most likely that from a group of promising outsiders like Quincy Crew, Alliance, T1 and Spirit, someone will be able to unexpectedly shine and get into the top 6 of the tournament.
